This post explores the challenges of generating deterministic random numbers and using cosine within Nix expressions. It highlights that Nix's purity, while beneficial for reproducibility, makes tasks like generating unique identifiers difficult without resorting to external dependencies or impure functions. The author demonstrates various approaches, including using the derivation name as a seed for a pseudo-random number generator (PRNG) and leveraging builtins.currentTime as a less deterministic but readily available alternative. The post also delves into the lack of a built-in cosine function in Nix and presents workarounds, like writing a custom implementation or relying on a pre-built library, showcasing the trade-offs between self-sufficiency and convenience.
This blog post demystifies Nix derivations by demonstrating how to build a simple C++ "Hello, world" program from scratch, without using Nix's higher-level tools. It meticulously breaks down a derivation file, explaining the purpose of each attribute like builder, args, and env, showing how they control the build process within a sandboxed environment. The post emphasizes understanding the underlying mechanism of derivations, offering a clear path from source code to a built executable. This hands-on approach provides a foundational understanding of how Nix builds software, paving the way for more complex and practical Nix usage.
Hacker News users generally praised the article for its clear explanation of Nix derivations. Several commenters appreciated the "bottom-up" approach, finding it more intuitive than other introductions to Nix. Some pointed out the educational value in manually constructing derivations, even if it's not practical for everyday use, as it helps solidify understanding of Nix's fundamentals. A few users offered minor suggestions for improvement, such as including a section on multi-output derivations and addressing the complexities of stdenv. There was also a brief discussion comparing Nix to other build systems like Bazel.
Dagger introduces a portable, reproducible development and CI/CD environment using containers. It acts as a programmable shell, allowing developers to define their build pipelines as code using a simple, declarative language (CUE). This approach eliminates environment inconsistencies by executing every step within containers, from dependency installation to testing and deployment. Dagger caches build steps efficiently, speeding up development cycles, and its container-native nature ensures builds behave identically across different machines, from developer laptops to CI servers. This allows developers to focus on building software, not wrestling with environment configurations.
Hacker News users discussed Dagger's potential, its similarity to other tools, and its reliance on Go. Several commenters saw it as a promising evolution of build systems and CI/CD, praising its portability and potential to simplify complex workflows. Comparisons were made to Nix, BuildKit, and Earthly, with some arguing Dagger offered a more user-friendly approach using a familiar shell-like syntax. Concerns were raised about the Go dependency, potentially limiting its adoption in non-Go environments and adding complexity for tasks like cross-compilation. The dependence on a container runtime was also noted, while some appreciated the declarative nature of configurations, others expressed skepticism about its long-term practicality. There was also interest in its ability to interface with existing tools like Docker Compose and Kubernetes.
This blog post details how to use Nix to manage persistent software installations on a Steam Deck, separate from the read-only SteamOS filesystem. The author leverages a separate ext4 partition formatted and mounted at /opt, where Nix stores its packages. This setup allows users to install and manage software without affecting the integrity of the core system, offering a robust and reproducible environment. The guide covers partitioning, mounting, installing Nix, configuring the system to recognize the Nix store, and provides practical examples for installing and running applications like Discord and installing desktop environments like KDE Plasma. This approach offers a significant advantage for users seeking a more flexible and powerful software management solution on their Steam Deck.
Several commenters on Hacker News expressed skepticism about the practicality of using Nix on the Steam Deck, citing complexity, limited storage space, and potential performance impacts. Some suggested alternative solutions like using Flatpak or simply managing game installations through Steam directly. Others questioned the need for persistent packages at all for gaming. However, a few commenters found the approach interesting and appreciated the author's exploration of Nix on a non-traditional platform, showcasing its flexibility. Some acknowledged the potential benefits of reproducible environments, especially for development or modding. The discussion also touched on the steep learning curve of Nix and the need for better documentation and tooling to make it more accessible.
NixOS aims for reproducibility, but subtle discrepancies can arise. While package builds are generally deterministic thanks to Nix's controlled environment, issues like differing system times during builds, non-deterministic build processes within packages themselves, and reliance on external resources like network-fetched timestamps or random numbers can introduce variability. The author highlights these challenges and explores how they impact reproducibility in practice, demonstrating that while NixOS significantly improves build consistency, achieving perfect reproducibility requires careful attention and sometimes impractical restrictions. Flaky tests and varying build outputs are presented as evidence of these limitations, showcasing scenarios where identical Nix expressions produce different results.
Hacker News users discuss reproducibility issues encountered with NixOS, despite its declarative nature. Several commenters point out that while Nix excels at package reproducibility, issues arise from external factors like hardware differences (particularly GPUs and networking) and reliance on non-reproducible external resources like timestamps and random number generation. One compelling comment highlights the distinction between "build reproducibility" and "runtime reproducibility," arguing NixOS effectively achieves the former but struggles with the latter. Others suggest that focusing solely on bit-for-bit reproducibility is misplaced, and that NixOS's value lies in its robust declarative configuration and ease of rollback, even if perfect reproducibility remains a challenge. The importance of properly caching build dependencies for true reproducibility is also emphasized. Several users share anecdotal experiences with inconsistencies and difficulties reproducing specific configurations, especially when dealing with complex setups or proprietary drivers.
Summary of Comments ( 0 )
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43669057
Hacker News users discussed the blog post about reproducible random number generation in Nix. Several commenters appreciated the clear explanation of the problem and the proposed solution using a cosine function to distribute builds across build machines. Some questioned the practicality and efficiency of the cosine approach, suggesting alternatives like hashing or simpler modulo operations, especially given potential performance implications and the inherent limitations of pseudo-random number generators. Others pointed out the complexities of truly distributed builds in Nix and the need to consider factors like caching and rebuild triggers. A few commenters expressed interest in exploring the cosine method further, acknowledging its novelty and potential benefits in certain scenarios. The discussion also touched upon the broader challenges of achieving determinism in build systems and the trade-offs involved.
The Hacker News post titled "RNG and Cosine in Nix" sparked a discussion with several interesting comments.
One commenter questioned the practicality of the approach, pointing out that using a hash function directly would likely be simpler and more efficient than the proposed cosine-based method. They also expressed concern about potential bias introduced by using cosine and suggested that a more rigorous statistical analysis would be necessary to validate the randomness quality.
Another commenter echoed this sentiment, emphasizing the importance of proper statistical testing for random number generation. They recommended using established test suites like TestU01 to thoroughly evaluate the randomness properties of the generated sequence.
One user focused on the security implications, warning that the proposed method might not be suitable for cryptographic purposes due to potential predictability. They advised against using custom RNG solutions in security-sensitive contexts and recommended relying on well-vetted cryptographic libraries instead.
A further commenter offered a different perspective, suggesting that the approach might be useful for generating deterministic random values based on a seed. They envisioned applications in procedural generation, where consistent results are desirable.
Another individual highlighted the importance of understanding the underlying distribution of the generated random numbers. They noted that different applications may require different distributions (uniform, normal, etc.) and that simply generating seemingly random numbers without considering the distribution could lead to incorrect results.
Several commenters discussed the mathematical properties of the cosine function and its suitability for RNG. Some expressed skepticism, while others defended its potential, albeit with the caveat that careful analysis and testing are crucial.
Finally, some comments touched on the specific use case within Nix, the package manager mentioned in the title. They speculated about the potential benefits and drawbacks of using this method for generating unique identifiers or other random values within the Nix ecosystem. However, no definitive conclusions were drawn regarding its practical application in Nix.