A new study reveals that even wealthy Americans experience higher death rates than their economically disadvantaged European counterparts. Researchers compared mortality rates across different income levels in the US to those in 12 European countries and found that the richest 5% of Americans had similar death rates to the poorest 5% of Europeans. This disparity persists across various causes of death, including heart disease, cancer, and drug overdoses, suggesting systemic issues within the US healthcare system and broader societal factors like access to care, inequality, and lifestyle differences are contributing to the problem. The findings highlight that socioeconomic advantages in the US don't fully offset the elevated mortality risks compared to Europe.
Young men in their 20s in the UK are now earning less on average than their female counterparts, reversing a historical pay gap. This shift is largely attributed to women's increased university attendance and graduation rates, particularly in higher-paying fields, while men's educational attainment has stagnated. The decline in traditionally male-dominated industries, coupled with the rise of sectors favoring higher education, has left many young men without the qualifications needed for well-paying jobs. This trend is most pronounced in London, and raises concerns about the long-term economic prospects for this generation of men.
Hacker News commenters discuss potential reasons for the pay gap described in the article, including occupational choices, risk tolerance, and work-life balance prioritization. Some dispute the premise, arguing that comparing all men to all women is misleading and suggest controlling for factors like career choice would yield a different result. Others highlight societal pressures and expectations influencing men's and women's career paths. The role of education, particularly the higher proportion of women in university, is also debated, with some suggesting this contributes to women's higher earning potential early in their careers. Several commenters point to the lack of support systems for men and boys, particularly in education, as a contributing factor to their lagging behind. The overall sentiment appears to be a mix of skepticism towards the article's conclusions and genuine concern about the underlying issues raised.
The website "WTF Happened In 1971?" presents a series of graphs suggesting a significant societal shift around that year. Many economic indicators, like productivity, real wages, housing affordability, and the gold-dollar relationship, appear to diverge from their post-WWII trends around 1971. The site implies a correlation between these changes and the Nixon administration's decision to end the Bretton Woods system, taking the US dollar off the gold standard, but doesn't explicitly claim causation. It serves primarily as a visual compilation of data points prompting further investigation into the potential causes and consequences of these economic and societal shifts.
Hacker News users discuss potential causes for the economic shift highlighted in the linked article, "WTF Happened in 1971?". Several commenters point to the Nixon Shock, the end of the Bretton Woods system, and the decoupling of the US dollar from gold as the primary driver, leading to increased inflation and wage stagnation. Others suggest it's an oversimplification, citing factors like the oil crisis, increased competition from Japan and Germany, and the peak of US manufacturing dominance as contributing factors. Some argue against a singular cause, proposing a combination of these elements along with demographic shifts and the end of the post-WWII economic boom as a more holistic explanation. A few more skeptical commenters question the premise entirely, arguing the presented correlations don't equal causation and that the chosen metrics are cherry-picked. Finally, some discuss the complexities of measuring productivity and the role of technological advancements in influencing economic trends.
Summary of Comments ( 10 )
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43584156
HN commenters discuss potential confounders not addressed in the Ars Technica article about differing death rates. Several suggest that racial disparities within the US are a significant factor, with one user pointing out the vastly different life expectancies between Black and white Americans, even within high-income brackets. Others highlight the potential impact of access to healthcare, with some arguing that even wealthy Americans may face barriers to consistent, quality care compared to Europeans. The role of lifestyle choices, such as diet and exercise, is also raised. Finally, some question the methodology of comparing wealth across different countries and economic systems, suggesting purchasing power parity (PPP) may be a more accurate metric. A few commenters also mention the US's higher rates of gun violence and car accidents as potential contributors to the mortality difference.
The Hacker News post titled "Wealthy Americans have death rates on par with poor Europeans," linking to an Ars Technica article, has generated a number of comments discussing the complexities of comparing health outcomes across different countries and socioeconomic groups.
Several commenters delve into the potential reasons behind the disparity highlighted in the article. Some point to the fragmented and profit-driven nature of the American healthcare system as a significant contributing factor, arguing that even wealthy Americans may face barriers to timely and effective care due to issues like high costs, insurance complexities, and administrative hurdles. They contrast this with European systems that offer more universal coverage and often emphasize preventative care.
Others discuss the potential influence of lifestyle factors, suggesting that even wealthy Americans might engage in less healthy behaviors compared to their European counterparts, such as consuming less nutritious diets, exercising less frequently, or experiencing higher levels of stress related to work or societal pressures. These commenters acknowledge that while access to healthcare is important, it's not the sole determinant of health outcomes.
The issue of data interpretation and comparison also arises in the discussion. Some users question the methodologies used in such studies, raising concerns about how accurately different countries collect and report health data. They also point to the difficulty of isolating specific factors like wealth when comparing populations across countries with varying cultural norms, social safety nets, and environmental factors. For instance, some commenters suggest that factors like social mobility and income inequality, which differ significantly between the US and many European countries, could play a role in the observed health disparities.
Furthermore, some comments highlight the potential impact of access to social support systems. They argue that stronger social safety nets in European countries, even for the poor, might mitigate some of the negative health consequences of poverty, while the more individualistic American society might leave even wealthy individuals more vulnerable during times of health crisis.
Finally, several commenters offer anecdotal evidence from their personal experiences navigating healthcare systems in the US and Europe, providing real-world illustrations of the challenges and advantages of each. These anecdotes add a personal dimension to the discussion, highlighting the human impact of the statistical trends presented in the article.