Transit agencies are repeatedly lured by hydrogen buses despite their significant drawbacks compared to battery-electric buses. Hydrogen buses are far more expensive to operate, requiring costly hydrogen production and fueling infrastructure, while battery-electric buses leverage existing electrical grids. Hydrogen technology also suffers from lower efficiency, meaning more energy is wasted in producing and delivering hydrogen compared to simply charging batteries. While proponents tout hydrogen's faster refueling time, battery technology advancements are closing that gap, and improved route planning can minimize the impact of charging times. Ultimately, the article argues that the continued investment in hydrogen buses is driven by lobbying and a misguided belief in hydrogen's potential, rather than a sound economic or environmental assessment.
The interactive map on Subwaysheds.com visualizes how far you can travel on the New York City subway system within a 40-minute timeframe from any given station. By selecting a station, the map reveals a shaded area encompassing all reachable destinations within that time limit. This allows users to quickly grasp the relative accessibility of different parts of the city from various starting points, highlighting the subway's reach and potential travel limitations. The map demonstrates how travel times vary greatly depending on the station's location and the interconnectedness of the lines, with some stations offering access to a much wider area than others within the same 40-minute window.
Commenters on Hacker News largely praised the visualization and the technical execution of the "Subway Sheds" project, finding it both interesting and well-designed. Several appreciated the choice of 40 minutes as a relatable timeframe for commute planning. Some discussed the limitations of the visualization, noting it doesn't account for transfer time or walking to/from stations, and pointed out discrepancies with their own commute experiences. A few commenters offered suggestions for improvements, such as incorporating real-time data, displaying route options, and allowing users to input their own starting points and timeframes. Others shared anecdotal experiences of their commutes in different cities, comparing and contrasting them with the NYC subway system's reach as depicted in the visualization. A technical discussion also emerged regarding the algorithms and data used to generate the sheds, including the choice of using walking distances instead of incorporating bus routes.
Subway Stories is a crowdsourced collection of short, true anecdotes about everyday life on the New York City subway. These vignettes capture the diverse range of human experiences that unfold underground, from chance encounters and acts of kindness to moments of absurdity and quiet observation. The website serves as a digital tapestry of the city's vibrant and often unpredictable subterranean world, offering a glimpse into the lives of the millions who pass through its tunnels each day. It's a testament to the shared humanity and unique character of the NYC subway, presenting a mosaic of moments that are both relatable and distinctly New York.
Hacker News users discuss the "Subway Stories" project, largely praising its nostalgic and artistic value. Some commenters share personal anecdotes of their own subway experiences, echoing the themes of chance encounters and shared humanity found on the site. Others analyze the technical aspects of the project, appreciating its minimalist design and questioning the choice of technology used. A few express skepticism about the authenticity of some submissions, while others lament the decline of similar community art projects in the internet age. The overall sentiment is positive, with many users finding the site to be a refreshing reminder of the unique human tapestry of the New York City subway system.
Summary of Comments ( 375 )
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43363293
Hacker News commenters largely agree with the article's premise that hydrogen buses are an inefficient and costly alternative to battery-electric buses. Several commenters point out the significantly lower lifecycle costs and superior efficiency of battery-electric technology, citing real-world examples and studies. Some discuss the lobbying power of the fossil fuel industry as a driving force behind hydrogen adoption, framing it as a way to preserve existing gas infrastructure. A few offer counterpoints, suggesting niche applications where hydrogen might be viable, like very long routes or extreme climates, but these are generally met with skepticism, with other users arguing that even in these scenarios, battery-electric solutions are superior. The overall sentiment leans heavily towards battery-electric as the more practical and environmentally sound option for public transit.
The Hacker News post titled "Why do transit agencies keep falling for the hydrogen bus myth?" generated a moderate amount of discussion with varied viewpoints. Several commenters echoed the article's sentiment, expressing skepticism towards hydrogen buses and highlighting the inefficiency of producing hydrogen, particularly when compared to electric buses. They pointed out the energy losses involved in converting electricity to hydrogen and then back to electricity to power the bus, emphasizing the superior efficiency of directly using electricity to charge batteries. Some also raised concerns about the environmental impact of hydrogen production if it relies on fossil fuels.
A recurring theme in the comments was the influence of lobbying and vested interests in promoting hydrogen technology, potentially clouding the judgment of transit agencies. Commenters speculated that political pressure and the allure of "new" technology might be contributing factors to the adoption of hydrogen buses despite their drawbacks.
However, not all comments were against hydrogen buses. Some commenters acknowledged specific niche applications where hydrogen might be advantageous, such as long-distance routes or situations where fast refueling is critical. They suggested that hydrogen could potentially play a role in a diversified public transport system, complementing battery-electric buses rather than replacing them entirely. One commenter also brought up the potential for hydrogen to be produced through electrolysis using renewable energy sources, addressing the environmental concerns raised by others. However, this sparked a counter-argument about the greater efficiency of directly using that renewable energy for charging batteries.
Another point raised was the lack of existing hydrogen infrastructure, which poses a significant hurdle to widespread adoption. Building out hydrogen refueling stations requires substantial investment, and the absence of such infrastructure makes it more challenging for transit agencies to transition to hydrogen buses.
Overall, the comments section presented a mix of perspectives on the viability of hydrogen buses. While many commenters were critical of the technology, emphasizing its inefficiencies and questioning the motives behind its adoption, others offered more nuanced views, suggesting potential niche applications and highlighting the possibility of cleaner hydrogen production. The discussion revolved around efficiency, environmental impact, infrastructure challenges, and the potential influence of lobbying.